Ercoupe questions

As a previous owner of a conventional Ercoupe 415-c my opinion:

1.  The Ercoupe is more valuable and a better airplane without the rudder pedals which do nothing to increase safety or utility.

2.  In the air, of course, there is little difference.  Landing and takeoff  with rudder pedals is more like a conventional airplane, but the Ercoupe was designed with a landing gear which can handle the side loads resulting from a crabbed landing.  I can remember flying on windy crosswind days when planes with conventional controls were staying on the ground.

Chuck

Thanks Chuck, I appreciate the honesty.

Jim:

I had a 415CD when I took my private pilot flight test decades ago.  The examiner took an extra half hour or so working to manage slips with the minimal rudder effectiveness.  Mine had only one rudder effective in each direction and they were of minimal use.  At the time I had mine,  there was no discernable premium (or penalty) for the pedals.  It was a fun little plane.

I just took (and passed) my Sport Pilot check ride, flying a pedal-less Ercoupe 415-C, two weeks ago. Back in April, with my instructor, I got the chance to experience its crosswing capabilites. The wind was pretty stiff that day. Gusting to 19kts. And nearly a straight 90 degrees. Making the approach with that much crab was a bit disconcerning, at first. But, once the mains touched, she straightened herself right out. Other than working to keep the wings level, on final, it really was not much of an issue. And while I'm not going to be out purposely looking for it, it's nice to know the plane can handle it.

Well, Mike, since I'm now looking at Sport Pilot, that helps a lot.  Thanks.

The rudder pedal conversion does not add to the flying qualities of the Ercoupe, in my opinion. Worse yet, the rudder conversion takes up valuable space in the rather “cozy” cockpit. It is a common misconception that the no-rudder pedal Ercoupe does not have crosswind landing procedure…it does and it works well. However, it’s important to make sure a no-rudder Ercoupe has not had a nose wheel mod or crushed main gear shock donuts that allow the tail too sit low on the ground. There is a lot of info out there about the low tail problem (easy to fix) and how it affects crosswind handling. Of course, if a no-rudder plane is going to be used to obtain a pilot certificate, the certificate is limited to that model of plane only.

 I have an Ercoupe 415 CD and the rudder pedals are hanging on the wall of my hangar where they belong.  I have no plans of re-installing them.  The plane was designed to fly well and coordinated without them and it does.  As an aftermarket add-on, the limited rudder movement gives no significant advantage but causes a loss of auto-coordination.  You're better off buying a 'coupe without rudder pedals, or if you do buy one with, remove them!  Fly the Ercoupe the way it was designed to be flown. 

If you are going for your sport pilot test in the Ercoupe, the rudder pedals (though pretty much ineffective) are an advantage because without them, the examiner might restrict your certificate to an Ercoupe without rudder pedals.

I took my test in a rudderless Ercoupe and now I am restricted to that plane.  I will have to take the examination over again if I want to fly any other plane.  My preference is no rudder pedals, but take the test in a plane with rudder pedals.

Sassafratzinratzindramer!
  This is the FOURTH time I've tried to reply to the last two posts.  The program isn't working right and EAA knows it! 

Pat, I like you comments on where exactly the rudder pedals should be.

Fred, thanks for the heads up.  That little bit of info is going to be a key to my whole approach ( pun intended ). 

Folks - I own a 1946 Coupe 415C and  hangar it in Frederick Md. We did not have the pedals but added them. Flew it tonight with the windows down and the biggest issue I see is the lack of foot room with them. But we spent over $2000 to install them and right now we just accept the fact that we  have them. My partner took his private check ride with them in   and has no restrictions. Not sure if there is a restricted license anymore. Even with the pedals I still land in the crab in a crosswind and she straightens out every time. Great plane and very inexpensive to fly. just be sure you have an experienced Ercoupe mechanic around.  

James, are there no slicks available any more to use on the mains.  I thought the rudderless Ercoupe was intended to be flown with slicks on the main.

I have a friend who took his private-pilot exam in a rudderless Ercoupe and was restricted. (Un-be-knownst to him, Which caught up with him when he sold the 'coupe and bought a Tri-Pacer. But that's another story.)

That was a concern for me to the extent that I put off finishing up my training, for a couple of years, looking for the right plane that I could fly with hand-controls. (I'm Post-Polio) Unfortunately I was having no luck finding one in my area. Last fall a couple of aviation friends talked me into finishing up in the Ercoupe. Explaining that if I did get restricted, I could take care of it later. At least I'd have my ticket.

However, having passed the sport-pilot check ride a couple weeks back, I can tell you that I have not been restricted. And, according to my CFI, becasue of the "class" brackets in the LSA regs, they can't restrict you. Don;t know for sure if that's true or not. All I know is that I'm not restricted. (Which means I wasted 2 years, worryin' over nothin'. Typical me.)

Years ago I received my private in a 2 control ercoupe. I understood that when they first came out privates were restricted to 2 control, but this was lifted fairly quickly.  I am surprised thart sport pilots are being restricted.  I thought this was resolved 60 years ago.

I got my certificate in Ohio, 4 years ago, so I know they were putting the restriction on as recently as that.  Maybe it depends on the examiner ( although that should not make any difference).  If they are not doing it anymore, does anyone have a suggestion how to get it lifted, other than retaing the exam?

I am a sport pilot designated examiner and I assure you we are required to issue the no rudder pedal restriction; it ends up printed on the pilot certificate. I don’t agree with this requirement…it could easily have been handled with a two-control/three-control endorsement, but you gota do what the Feds require. We are told that we must apply the limitation because FARs 61.45(b)(1) and 61.45(b)(2) address the airplane’s capability to meet all PTS requirements. However, the sport pilot PTS task K (forward slips) has a note that states, “This task applies to airplane capable of performing slips.” In my opinion, if you are flying a two-control Ercoupe, the task does not apply. The Feds also say the Ercoupe cannot demonstrate a crosswind takeoff or landing. Of course the Ercoupe can perform crosswind operations, it just uses a different technique than a three-control plane. However, I have been out-voted by the Feds and I issue the limitation.